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MadCast: Munsa

Gentleperson's Deckbuilding Club

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Deckbuilding, as a genre, covers a wide variety of experiences.  The brands that immediately leap to most folk (Magic: The Gathering, Yu-gi-oh, Pokemon, Hearthstone, et al) all trend toward the PvP side of the genre, and provide a wide depth of simple to complex play.  Further into the genre is a wealth of singleplayer and cooperative deckbuilding experiences (Slay the Spire, Monster Train, LOTRLCG, and a slew of other titles) that take the mechanics of competitive deckbuilding and apply them to familiar genres like RPGs, Roguelikes/lites, and Strategy to tell good stories or provide near infinitely repeatable instanced gameplay (a la Binding of Isaac).

Deckbuilding games are unique in that they provide two distinct-but-overlapping modes of play.  Actually playing the game covers the majority of the venn diagram, but there is a crescent moon of "other" peeking impishly out from behind it which comprises the various theories and analyses of how to construct your deck.  Some games blur this distinction more than others, such as constructing your deck as you play vs fully constructing your deck prior to play, but either way you end up with this deep pool of knowledge that is not exactly independent to each game.  

While each game can vary wildly in HOW these mechanics are inserted into play, the mechanics of a deck are relatively uniform across most of these games.  A deck is, at its core, a bounded set of repeating, changing possibilities, and an individual game can only bend this truth so much before it strays from the genre.  Across the genre, even in games that deliver starkly different experiences, there is a shared language and set of mathematical principles that tie these games together.  The more deckbuilding games you play, the more these harmonies become apparent and the easier it becomes to adapt to new titles.

Thusly, I think it would be foolish to construct a gaming group around a single title.  Instead, I am proposing that we identify in this thread a group of soon-to-be fellow enthusiasts.  If you chat on the regular with another FM about Slay the Spire or Magic: The Gathering, my intent is for this club to provide a way for anyone with a love of the genre to associate with similarly interested people and discover communal ways to enjoy these games.

I have some very specific ideas and conceptions in my head of the sorts of activities this club can engage in.  We can structure competitive nights for the PvP CCGs.  We can do group-play of singleplayer titles, where the hot seat rotates and the direct player streams to the group and we collectively strategize.  We can also get together to chill and have a discussion about various games.  My hope would be that, given some time to get the groove right, we could even turn these discussions into collaborative creative products like guides and essays that could fulfill one of the options under the Full Membership Terms.

If this interests you, please enter this thread with all of your own ideas for what we could do as a group, and give an inkling into what games you currently play.  For example:  
 

Munsa's Deckbuilding Games

  • Currently Playing: Monster Train, Slay the Spire, Griftlands, Steamworld Quest (Switch)
  • Has Experience With: MTG, Hearthstone, Eternal CG, LOTR LCG (both physical and digital)

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Currently Playing: Slay The Spire, Hearthstone, Legends of Runeterra, MTG:A
Has Experience With: Yugioh, Pokemon, Card Fight Vanguard, Gwent

It falls under the umbrella of Hearthstone, but they have a battlegrounds game mode that now allows people to make private matches. It's an auto-chess of sorts for drafting and I think it's a lot of fun. It's not necessarily a TCG but it feels a lot like real time deck building. 

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I like the idea of collective streams, and comparing strategies, or even just thoughtfully explaining why you would or wouldn't take specific items, cards etc.  

I watch Jorbs on twitch a fair bit for StS strategy, and it was there that I first saw Monster Train.  I've been addicted ever since 😃.  Right now I'm working on my 9th race combination completion at max rank.  There were some recent changes introduced that provide the player with more information, but I'm not really building tactical decks for each type of end boss yet.

Angelix's Deckbuilding Games

  • Currently Playing: Monster Train and StS.  I've seen some Griftlands Streams, but haven't played.  Haven't heard of Steamworld Quest, and do not have a switch.
  • Has Experience With: Hearthstone (I'm a few expansions out of date), Meteorfall (android)

 

 

 

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Currently Playing: Not much atm, Slay the Spire, L5R on occasion

Has Experience With: Duelyst, MTG, Android: Netrunner, AGOT LCG, Hearthstone, many of the 'board game' deckbuilders like Dominion, Ascension, Clank!/Clank in Space, Marvel LCG, Arkham Horror LCG, etc

Haven't picked up Monster Train, there's a lot of games to play still (just picked up CK3)

I think a key thing to cover is common mechanics in deckbuilding games and what they mean in terms of gameplay (IE discarding/using your whole hand every turn and redrawing a new hand is a common mechanic)

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13 hours ago, MadCast: Pushover said:

Arkham Horror LCG

Do you by chance know of any Arkham Horror computer games?  I love the Arkham Horror board game, but have not been able to find any online games that mimic the feel.  I would love to see Arkham Horror done in the style of Armello, which is one of the better online board games I've found to date.

 

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20 hours ago, MadCast: doublestufforeo said:

It falls under the umbrella of Hearthstone, but they have a battlegrounds game mode that now allows people to make private matches. It's an auto-chess of sorts for drafting and I think it's a lot of fun. It's not necessarily a TCG but it feels a lot like real time deck building. 

Agreed.  I was going to mention Teamfight Tactics for the same reason.  I do find TFT is a lot simpler than most deckbuilders, but requires better quick decision making, and you do need to adapt to your opponents, which adds a layer of complexity.  

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3 hours ago, Angelix said:

Do you by chance know of any Arkham Horror computer games?  I love the Arkham Horror board game, but have not been able to find any online games that mimic the feel.  I would love to see Arkham Horror done in the style of Armello, which is one of the better online board games I've found to date.

 

I'm not aware of any good ones. Hoping that the Gloomhaven online port ends up good (multiplayer is coming soon, supposedly), which could *very loosely* be considered a deckbuilder, but that's more of a cooperative dungeon crawl than a horror/mystery cooperative game.

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2 hours ago, MadCast: Pushover said:

I'm not aware of any good ones. Hoping that the Gloomhaven online port ends up good (multiplayer is coming soon, supposedly), which could *very loosely* be considered a deckbuilder, but that's more of a cooperative dungeon crawl than a horror/mystery cooperative game.

I'm ok with cooperative dungeon crawl 😃  I enjoy deckbuilders, but play a lot of different genres.

I just went back to look, and I've seen some ads for Gloomhaven on Steam.  It definitely feels like a mix between cards and position turn based game, sort of like XCOM meets deckbuilder.  I'm curious to see how it turns out.

Edited by Angelix

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4 hours ago, MadCast: Munsa said:

I am tickled to see that folks not only share my love of deckbuilding, but also my love of cooperative dungeon crawlers.  Y'all played For the King?

I have the game, but haven't played it yet.  I did play Wildermyth a fair bit.

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Just watched Rife stream Slay the Spire over discord until 2am, and discussed deck builds the whole time he was playing. 

Incidentally, it turns out that I'm an authentic non-removable curse.  He was having some very poor card draws on important turns pretty much every game.

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22 hours ago, MadCast: Munsa said:

Y'all played For the King?

I have that, also Gauntlet, Torchlight, and Magicka 2, if you count those. I love all of those games. 

Edited by MadCast: doublestufforeo

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So, real talk.  In two weeks, I'm moving (starting the 24th, with the following weekend to set up new spot).  If we wanted to have an organisational sitdown prior to my disruption, the best day for ME would be next thursday, the 17th, at anytime in the afternoon/evening (4PM EST and onward.)  If that doesn't work, that is okay, and we will schedule something once I am moved in.

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5 hours ago, MadCast: Munsa said:

If we wanted to have an organisational sitdown prior to my disruption, the best day for ME would be next thursday, the 17th, at anytime in the afternoon/evening (4PM EST and onward.)  

I'm a PST time zoner, and therefore likely working until 7PM EST, getting home roughly an hour later.  Probably the earliest I could commit to that evening would be 8PM EST.  If that doesn't work, I'll attend the next one.

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Since we were discussing Risk of Rain as potentially falling under this category...  I took the screenshot below as soon as I finished my blue portal infinite kill prepping for an Acrid Monsoon Mastery run.  Apparently you can use the obliterate portal on the last round, but it didn't spawn for me, so I had to fight the boss. 

Incidentally, I saw Illidan on my way to the final boss, and he told me I was WAY over prepared.

If you stand on a pillar during the last phase, and drop 5 or 6 equipment missile stikes on the boss, you get a fair amount of gear back with pretty much no risk.  Should work for melee builds too, which is something to consider.

Once my poison drained him to 1 hitpoint, which I could've done even with no equipment or missile strikes at all since it has a 1% health drain per tick, a single attack is all it takes to kill him.  In this case I used another equipment salvo. 

It also appeared that his AOE carousel of death does not reach you if you are standing on the pillars or ramp.  However, I had 6k+ shield, and 4-5k health at that point, so it's possible I just wasn't noticing the hits.  At that point, I also had 40 or more teddy bears as well as the rejuvenation horns and a bunch of other items. 

I ran this with the artifacts that let you select your items, let you loot from monster kills, and that cause both allies and enemies to do friendly fire (which means splash damage hits your own character if you are too close).  I used the last artifact (Chaos) to self proc thorns in the early melee game using gasoline. 

I do not recommend gearing up like I did... it's really not necessary.

Monsoon_Acrid_Mastery_Run.png

Edited by Angelix

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17 hours ago, MadCast: Munsa said:

How does 10PM EST on the 17th sound?

Works for me.

  • Currently Playing: Monster Train, Slay the Spire, Risk of Rain 2, MTG: Commander
  • Has Experience With:  Star Realms, Dominion, Spirit Island, Hearthstone

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I think a really good suggestion tonight was to play all our big risk of rain games in the future with the death artifact that wipes the group if a single person dies. 

It will force more creative and cooperative play, and prevent folks from falling behind.

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18 hours ago, Angelix said:

I think a really good suggestion tonight was to play all our big risk of rain games in the future with the death artifact that wipes the group if a single person dies. 

It will force more creative and cooperative play, and prevent folks from falling behind.

Agreed.  

Rife and I were playing today and found that also turning Sacrifice off offered a more enjoyable and dynamic experience with each map; which also put more emphasis on mobility and teamwork. 

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